The joys and perils of buying a suit from the other side of the world.
Here's an example of where the internet and modern communications have transformed what's possible. Online meets offline, personalised service in a mass-market, off-shore manufacture, on-shore sales - it's a whole world of opposites.
If you know me, you'll know I'm tall and slim. The "slim patroller" they used to call me in the day. Getting clothes to fit me is very difficult, never mind a suit. I can get the fit on the shoulders only to find no length in the sleeves and a tent around my middle. Trousers that fit my waist don't reach my ankles.
Recently into a new job, I thought it was time to invest in a new suit. I managed to squeeze 10 years out of the last one, but the poor old thing had had it's day.
This time I thought I'd try a tailor made suit (for the reasons mentioned above), but I didn't want to spend a fortune on Saville Row.
I'd heard of Raja Fashions before having seen their adverts in the papers. You might have seen them too - they talk of a Hong Kong tailor, Mr Daswani, who travels the world (mainly the UK and the USA) to measure up clients for his team of tailors in Hong Kong. You're promised high street prices, but tailor made quality.
(Offline advertising for brand awareness)
I recalled the name so I went online and searched Google for "Raja" and "Hong Kong Tailors" and sure, soon enough I found their site. On the site, I found a list of dates when he would be in London, and I could make an online reservation from the site for the date and time that suited me. As it happened I had a 3 week wait before my Saturday appointment at a Kensington hotel suite.
(Online lead generation and appointment facility)
I was kind of expecting to see Mr Daswani, but no, the room had 4 younger guys from his team, with suitcases of fabric samples, tape measures and credit card swipe machines. Very quickly I was being seen to by "Dennis" (I'm sure that's not his real name) who very quickly started to take details about what I wanted. I said I wanted 2 suits, one simple black one and a slightly more fashionable brown pinstripe. He measured me up, and asked questions about various options I had such as type of vents, width of lapel, angle of pockets, number of pockets etc etc. To be honest I wasn't quite sure what I wanted, it felt uncomfortably fast and I was getting flustered. Maybe that was his technique. Moving so fast I was caught off guard on the negotiation front. I was expecting to pay £300 to £400 per suit. In the end, with upgraded fabric, nice lining etc, I was looking at £650 a suit. I also went for a white shirt (only £50), so the total bill was a whopping £1350. Ouch. Whilst I was being distracted by a guy taking my photo, my credit card was already being processed and only 25 minutes after walking in I was leaving wondering how on earth I managed to just drop that kind of money and would I get what I wanted?
(Old fashioned pen and carbon copied paper, and a "tiger" for a salesman)
I was told to expect my suits within 4-6 weeks. 3 weeks in and the shirt arrived. Great fit, just that it was a little tight around the collar. I don't usually wear a tie, so I let it go. It was great to have a shirt that didn't flap across my chest and was long enough on the sleeves and tails.Being cotton, it has shrunk a small amount too. I thinkif I were to order more of these I'd get and extra 1/2 inch on the collar.
(International parcel delivery)
I waited for the suits, but they didn't arrive. 7 weeks in I emailed Raja Fashions in Hong Kong and was told by reply that they had despatched about 3 weeks previously. I was given a Parcelforce tracking number which I looked up online. It's at this point that I started a period of 4 weeks of stress trying to get my suits. I don't think I'll go into the full details here (it warrants it's own blog post) except to say that the parcel had the wrong house number on it, it was apparently signed for and delivered at an address 4 doors down, by a name not heard of by the owners of the house, with the suit no-where to be seen.
Given that this happened at Christmas time and I was having to deal with Parcelforce's customer service centre (think: impossible call routing systems that have none of the options that relate to your situation).... well, you can imagine.
(Automated UK customer "care" - nothing of the sort!)
Three weeks later I had manage to confirm that the suits were not where Parcelforce said they were and was just about to call Mastercard to re-claim my outlay, when Raja Fashions confirmed that they would re-do the order and send the suits over within 2 weeks. I had almost given up.
(Email Hong Kong customer care, this time with results)
Sure enough to the day, my suits arrived and I was this time given an SMS to alert me of the delivery with a choice to choose a different day if the proposed day didn't work for me. Nice touch. Shame they didn't do this first time around and I might have managed to get the suits.
(SMS customer alerting)
My suits arrived in a cardboard box, slightly crupmled after their journey. I tried them on straight away with some nervousness. It was 3 months of effort, a signficant amount of stress and a fair chunk of change to get this far.
The result? Spot on. Absolutely fantastic fit. I sighed a big sigh of relief and looked forward to wearing my new threads.
I had to take the jacket of one suit to the local dry cleaner to get the crumples steamed out of the arms, but that was no big deal.
I've since enjoyed wearing my new suits and I must say, the feeling of tailor-made has me converted. It's lovely good quality wool fabric, feels very sharp. There's no going back to M+S again now.
Would I use Raja-Fashions again?
Yes - I think I would. I am very very happy with the end result. The process to get there was very stressful, but I think to be honest I was just unluckywith the delivery. Raja-Fashions redeemed themselves by re-doing the order once they were sure that it had gone missing.
I've got my next appointment in 6 weeks time. A supply of shirts is in order I feel!
Apart from my personal story, the story here is of a very successful business that is a real mix of all possible ways of doing business: offline advertising, online lead generation and appointments service, face to face sales, old-fashioned payment systems, off-shore manufacturing, personalised goods, international delivery, email customer service, SMS delivery alerting. By locating in Hong Kong but by travelling to their customers around the world, Mr Daswani has created a compelling business model that is going from strength to strength. Good for him I say. Good for me too, the lanky odd-ball that I am.
Saturday, 2 February 2008
Raja-Fashions Tailor-Made Hong Kong Suits, Online Meets Offline
David Norris, London, UK
Digital intrapreneur, internet operations and product marketing guy, fascinated by human behaviour
24 comments:
I'm interested to hear other people's comments about this crowd, because they also did s slick job on upgrading what I wanted. I wanted to spend bottom of the line to see how good they were before I invested some real money, but ended up speinding £325. The suit I got arrived on time and the material is really durable, but the cut of it is abyssmal, so I would never go back!!
I have to agree. The adverts are enticing, but the staff are salesmen, not tailors. It doesn't feel quite right to be offered a 'free upgrade' on a tailored suit...
Based on my experience with them, I'd guess that they run (ill-fitting) off-the-peg suits in HK and retain tailors in-country to complete minor adjustments. I’m sure Mr Daswani himself does an excellent job, but unfortunately, a tailor’s individual skills are not ‘scalable’ into this sort of operation.
I was measured for a ladies coat in October 2007 very expensive but as it is cashmere and made to measure decided to go ahead. The unfinished garment was sent to me and I went to a hotel in Reading for the final fitting at the beginning of December. The coat arrived in January 2008 - wrong colour, vent in the back which was not requested and no piping or braiding round neck and front as requested. They offered to make me a new coat in the colour chosen and this would be sent straight to me 'express delivery'. Arrived today just over 8 1/2 weeks later and once again there is a vent in the back, plain neck and front, the sleeves are too short, but hey - the colour is correct!!!! This has all taken over 5 months, hopefully the winter is over, and I still haven't got a coat to wear.
I've requested a home visit, so will keep you posted.
Don't go near these people. You'll be disappointed, Save up and go to Saville Row!
never heard of saville row - do you mean savile row?
Several good places there - but they are over priced for what they give you - Although if you want the english prestige etc, it's good - but most are utterly too formal, sadly
I wouldn't use them - they are after your money nothing else. Use a mid range jermyn street tailor where you can buy a made to measure suit (all measurements taken) for a very similiar amount of money. They are trustworthy and deliver an excellent product within 6 weeks with no hassle or stress at all. Raja fashions treats its customers vey poorly. Do not use.
I have just had a bad experience with Raja, I ordered a suit from them and it's turned up in the wrong colour and fitting badly...they are not returning my emails to find out what went wrong and as they're only here a few days a month I am finding it difficult to get recourse...my advice would be to steer clear...
when using Raja I felt I was hustled by pushy salespeople.
Since then, I have used the Eat-end tailor Luke's bespoke in Canning Town, slightly more expensive bu much better.
Highly recommended
http://www.thatstheshop.com/lukesbespoketailors.htm
This firm is to be avoided - for all the reasons given. They are pushy; they get the colours wrong; they do not follow instructions; their clothes do not fit! I wasted £2,000 on these people - it paid for one of their expensive and misleading adverts of course!
I have had tailor made suits by a visiting tailor from Bangkok quite a number of times and have always been satisfied. I have recommended quite a number of friends and they also have had no issues. There have been times when the pant length was too long and the waist a little small but they were easily alterable here in London and the Thai tailor reimbursed the cost. The outfit I use is Inders Fashion. A bloke named Suk comes over twice a year and helps me choose fabric and style. The good part about this tailor is that they are not pushy. I think the site is www.indersfashion.com - they say their main marketing is word of mouth and as far as I can tell they do their best to keep their clients happy!
My Friend recommended me to this tailor but i tried a suit and the quality was not good and i paid very high price US$ 550 for the suits and was not satisfied.
Many tailors in the far east seem to offer this service, and to be honest, they are much, MUCH more reasonably priced then what we get at home. Both my brother and I also use a tailoring service from the far east. They're "Crown Tailors." www.crowntailor.com. Pretty much it was what you described above, but as they come in a team of two, they are not pushy and over time, have developed quite a good personal relationship with us. We would highly recommend them as the team to meet and order suits and shirts from.
i used raja for a wedding suit last year, i went to be measured and was greated by 3 gentlemen. i was quickly measured and asked what exactly i wanted . when it came to payment i told them i would be paying a cash deposit of £80 until the suit was in the uk. they didnt realy like this but i think they liked the fact i paid with some cash. 6 weeks later i emailed them to see how it was going and it was getting very close to the wedding, a woman from hong kong phoned and was concerned about the payment i told them that if the suit would arrive within 1 week i would bacs them the money so i asked for the balance. i went for a mid - high end cloth and was told at the measuring it would be £550 which was ok, the lady in hongkong requested a balance of £250 so i paid it . the suit came that week and it is the best suit i have ever had and at a really good price i saved myself £220.
I've just had a suit measured for me by Raja-Fashions and it's the first tailored suit I've ever purchased. I got the impression that the guy wanted to rush me but I wouldn't let him. I asked questions about every aspect of the suit and even asked his opinion and eventually I think he started having a good time. He got me to 'upgrade' to a better fabric as seems to be the case with many people on this blog but in all honesty the £300.00 material felt cheap whereas the £400.00 material he showed me felt much nicer and I was happy to pay the difference. I haven't actually received the suit yet and judging by some people's experiences this is the most trying part but I live in hope.
Watch this space...
I just came back from hong kong where I had a suit made at Raja.
The fit and the material was indeed good. Then again whats the point of a custom tailored suit if not even that?
The tailoring job unfortunatelly lower than a 300 dollar off the rack. Specifically the stiching job arround the shoulders was really bad. Of course I am comparing this to other made to measure suits i had for the same price range.
If you are planning to fork out 500 to 800 for a suit look elsewhere, you would have a better change getting a nice suit off the rack and having it tailored.
I have used Raja for the last 3 years, and had about 6-7 suits made during that time. The first 3 suits were fantastic- great quality and cut. However, since then, I've felt the service has dropped significantly. Like others have commented, I feel the service is rushed and the "salesmen" are always trying to upsell you. The last 4 suits I have had made have all been badly made- despite apparently using the same measurements as before, they were very badly fitting. The only practical way to get the suits adjusted has been to wait for Raja to revisit London, and for the suits to be sent back to Hong Kong for altering. In all, that means two suits have taken nearly 5 months to be corrected (and they're still not perfect) and another two that needed correcting FOUR times(!) and took nearly 8 months to adjust.
During this time, I've found the Raja response pretty uncaring- they even had the cheek to try to sell me another suit when I went to see them to complain at the poor service I had received!
Overall, given the very obvious drop in quality in the last couple of years, I won't be using Raja again. There are other UK-based outfits that I'd rather try.
Pushy, rude salesmen intent on hustling you into a more expensive suit than you intended. The first fit was hopeless, and I had a pretty stressful time trying to get my suit in time for my daughter's wedding. It turned out OK (but no more than that) in the end, but it wasn't the pleasurable experience that bespoke tailoring ought to be, and I wouldn't use them again.
After moving to Bangkok from London and much research, I decided to try Tailor Pro.The sales person was very friendly and helpful and made my initial visit a good one. I was extremely satisfied by the two initial suits and shirts that I had made. Since then, I have had several other suits and shirts made here that are all of highest quality. I've also recommended Tailor Pro to several people back in London and here in Bangkok whom have been satisfied with the service and final product. My wife also had a woman's 3 piece suit made here and was also very happy with the results.
If looking for a good tailor, I could not recommend this place more!
I have four suits, two jackets and a number of shirts made by Raja Fashions. All of these were purchased in Hong Kong. There is no point in buying suits without a fitting - just to make sure that everything fits properly and you are completely happy with the style & cut. These suits were not the first tailored suits that I had made in Hong Kong.... But do not think that you are getting a bargain... this certainly is not the case... the suits that I bought were expensive despite all the "introductory offers" available with Hong Kong tailors. The salesmen spend an inordinate amount of time attempting to sell you better material and more product.... I am very happy with the cloth, style and fit of the suits - after all I chose the cloth and style. Another word of warning - be demanding, know exactly what you want, from the colour, lining colour, style, and specify everything... But as I say, I did visit the shop in Hong Kong.... I would not even attempt to order from the UK based upon measurements without any proper fitting by a tailor. This would only lead to disappointment. Would I order from Raja again, on another visit to Hong Kong? Only if I was flush with cash and had sufficient time to have the necessary fittings etc. But beware their salesmen are very pushy and no one gets a bargain - only a good quality suit in your particular style. Is it good value for money? A tailor in Jermyn Street is likely to be able to make something at a similar price... particularly now in the recession!
Never use Raja Fashions. I had a terrible experience after paying £400 for a suit, I returned 2 weeks later for the first fitting. It quickly became apparent that they hadn't made the suit but rather than be honest, the salesmen strung me a series of lies. Eventually they came clean and I was told to come back the next day for the final suit - if I didn't like it I would recieve a refund.
The next day I tried on the suit which did not fit at all as you might expect for one knocked up in 24 hours without any fittings. I was eventually given a refund and told I could keep the shirt as an apology for all the hassle the company had caused me.
When I arrived home I found that I had not received a refund. It was 3months, endless phone calls and emails before I got anything back and even then they insisted on charging me £100 for the supposedly free shirt. I even went to one of their hotel tours in an attempt to get my money back.
Don't use them - they ruined my holiday in Hong Kong and basically acted as criminals by retaining my money.
Interesting comments. Raja fashions have just advertised in New Zealand but after reading the comments I will be avoiding them.
While in Bangkok I have visited Jesse and Victor of Rajawongese http://www.dress-for-success.com/ after being recommended them.
Having read reviews which name them as one of the top tailors in Thailand I would have to agree. They are not pushy and do not try to make you upgrade. I spent 2 hours selecting my suit fabrics!
Unfortunately they don't travel the world (as they don’t need to) but well worth a visit if in Bangkok.
I am a prtner in Aptus Suits, a new Cotswold based tailoring company. Many of my clients come to me after buying Raja suits. Something that is fed back time and time again is this feeling of being rushed, pressured into making hasty decisions. I personally believe that tailoring is about much more than the beautiful, perfect fitting garment, it is also about a way of life, a level of service that you expect with this sort of investment. To achieve this, at Aptus we like to keep the personal touch. Our initial consultation takes about an hour, we discuss materials, cuts, and specifications for the suit. We also offer advice on what would best enhance your particular body shape. We then follow this up second and sometimes 3rd fittings (included in the price) to ensure the perfect fit. Our suits range from £360-£500 but there is no upgrading or any of the nonsense that you get with Raja.
So why are you paying so much for a Raja suit? sadly it is down to greed, and commercialisation. Raja fashions has very high running costs, think how much an advert in the times costs! thus these costs are passed onto their customers.
I personally think tailoring is about a family run business on a scale where you can build up an understanding with your tailor, its not about spending hours on the phone to Hong Kong chasing up suits.
Aptus Suits has recently launched its new website, http://www.tailored-suits.co.uk, we offer a lot more advice on buying the perfect suit.
www.cadandthedandy.co.uk London based guys and great suits, or at least the one they made for me is
I have bought from Raja Fashions several times but this time his suits were like magic.His quality of lining are better and workmanship is improved.
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